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Gastropubs. [Jun. 19th, 2009|02:39 pm]
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So, since I have been going on to hoshuteki for a while about doing some SCIENCE on the subject of gastropubs, and he has now published his thoughts on the subject on his excellent Pubology blog, I thought I should get my finger out and get started on the science. Here is my preliminary survey.

Please note: This is about "gastropub vs. pub", not "gastropub vs. restaurant" or "gastropub vs. anything else".

Please read the scoring instructions before you begin. You don't have to answer every item, but I'll assume a score of 3 for non-answered items unless you talk me out of it in the comments. Please comment if you think anything is confusing. Please also comment if you can think of any other items that should be included.

You can change your answers at any time, using the normal LiveJournal poll mechanism which I will link to once I know the poll ID.

Scoring:

  • 0 - an establishment with this feature is not a gastropub, regardless of any other features
  • 1 - an establishment with this feature is almost certainly not a gastropub
  • 2 - an establishment with this feature is probably not a gastropub
  • 3 - an establishment with this feature might be a gastropub or might not
  • 4 - an establishment with this feature is probably a gastropub
  • 5 - an establishment with this feature is almost certainly a gastropub
  • 6 - an establishment with this feature is definitely a gastropub, regardless of any other features
Poll #1418092
Open to: All, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 33

Entirely carpeted floor:

View Answers
Mean: 2.55 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.71
0
0 (0.0%)
1
3 (9.7%)
2
9 (29.0%)
3
18 (58.1%)
4
1 (3.2%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Partially carpeted floor:

View Answers
Mean: 2.87 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.49
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
3 (9.7%)
3
26 (83.9%)
4
1 (3.2%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Lighting too low to comfortably read a book:

View Answers
Mean: 2.97 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.64
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
7 (21.9%)
3
19 (59.4%)
4
6 (18.8%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has at least one fruit/quiz/games machine:

View Answers
Mean: 1.31 Median: 1 Std. Dev 0.63
0
2 (6.2%)
1
19 (59.4%)
2
10 (31.2%)
3
1 (3.1%)
4
0 (0.0%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has at least one TV or flatscreen:

View Answers
Mean: 1.78 Median: 2 Std. Dev 0.86
0
1 (3.1%)
1
12 (37.5%)
2
13 (40.6%)
3
5 (15.6%)
4
1 (3.1%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has at least one TV or flatscreen which is usually switched on:

View Answers
Mean: 1.31 Median: 1 Std. Dev 0.95
0
6 (18.8%)
1
14 (43.8%)
2
9 (28.1%)
3
2 (6.2%)
4
1 (3.1%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Provides newspapers:

View Answers
Mean: 3.35 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.70
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
18 (58.1%)
4
11 (35.5%)
5
1 (3.2%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Mismatched chairs

View Answers
Mean: 3.13 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.72
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
6 (20.0%)
3
14 (46.7%)
4
10 (33.3%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Unvarnished tables

View Answers
Mean: 3.42 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.94
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
3 (9.7%)
3
13 (41.9%)
4
10 (32.3%)
5
4 (12.9%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Hand-cut and/or triple-cooked chips on the menu:

View Answers
Mean: 4.29 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.89
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
1 (3.2%)
3
5 (16.1%)
4
10 (32.3%)
5
14 (45.2%)
6
1 (3.2%)

Chalkboard with specials (written in actual chalk, not painted on):

View Answers
Mean: 4.06 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.88
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
9 (29.0%)
4
13 (41.9%)
5
7 (22.6%)
6
2 (6.5%)

Describes itself as a gastropub (on menus, on its website, on signs, whatever):

View Answers
Mean: 4.53 Median: 4.5 Std. Dev 0.83
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
3 (9.4%)
4
13 (40.6%)
5
12 (37.5%)
6
4 (12.5%)

Doesn't have any handpulls/handpumps for real ale:

View Answers
Mean: 2.42 Median: 3 Std. Dev 1.13
0
3 (9.7%)
1
4 (12.9%)
2
3 (9.7%)
3
20 (64.5%)
4
0 (0.0%)
5
1 (3.2%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has at least one handpull/handpump for real ale:

View Answers
Mean: 3.10 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.30
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
27 (90.0%)
4
3 (10.0%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has more than one handpull/handpump for real ale:

View Answers
Mean: 3.00 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.51
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
4 (12.9%)
3
23 (74.2%)
4
4 (12.9%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has real ale on gravity (a cask with a tap that gets opened to let beer fall out with no need for a handpull):

View Answers
Mean: 2.81 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.74
0
0 (0.0%)
1
3 (9.7%)
2
3 (9.7%)
3
22 (71.0%)
4
3 (9.7%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has real cider (i.e. not Strongbow, Magners, etc):

View Answers
Mean: 3.10 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.64
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
5 (16.1%)
3
18 (58.1%)
4
8 (25.8%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has a wine list:

View Answers
Mean: 3.75 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.71
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
13 (40.6%)
4
14 (43.8%)
5
5 (15.6%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has a cocktail menu:

View Answers
Mean: 3.16 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.95
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
6 (19.4%)
3
13 (41.9%)
4
10 (32.3%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
1 (3.2%)

Some or all of the tables are set with cutlery and/or napkins and/or wine glasses and/or tablecloths:

View Answers
Mean: 4.55 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.61
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
0 (0.0%)
4
16 (51.6%)
5
13 (41.9%)
6
2 (6.5%)

Has an area set aside for diners that you're not allowed to sit in if you're just drinking:

View Answers
Mean: 4.13 Median: 5 Std. Dev 1.07
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
2 (6.5%)
3
9 (29.0%)
4
4 (12.9%)
5
15 (48.4%)
6
1 (3.2%)

Has stools at the bar:

View Answers
Mean: 2.74 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.51
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
6 (19.4%)
3
24 (77.4%)
4
0 (0.0%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Has a significant amount of space for standing-up drinking:

View Answers
Mean: 2.10 Median: 2 Std. Dev 0.69
0
0 (0.0%)
1
6 (19.4%)
2
16 (51.6%)
3
9 (29.0%)
4
0 (0.0%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

You're expected to wait to be seated:

View Answers
Mean: 4.78 Median: 5 Std. Dev 1.24
0
1 (3.1%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
3 (9.4%)
4
5 (15.6%)
5
14 (43.8%)
6
9 (28.1%)

You're expected to seat yourself:

View Answers
Mean: 2.87 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.61
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
5 (16.1%)
3
22 (71.0%)
4
3 (9.7%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Staff are wearing uniforms:

View Answers
Mean: 3.16 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.68
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
3 (9.7%)
3
22 (71.0%)
4
4 (12.9%)
5
2 (6.5%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Doesn't do food:

View Answers
Mean: 0.09 Median: 0 Std. Dev 0.29
0
29 (90.6%)
1
3 (9.4%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
0 (0.0%)
4
0 (0.0%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Does food at lunchtimes only:

View Answers
Mean: 1.32 Median: 1 Std. Dev 1.03
0
7 (22.6%)
1
12 (38.7%)
2
8 (25.8%)
3
3 (9.7%)
4
1 (3.2%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Does food in the evening only:

View Answers
Mean: 2.06 Median: 2 Std. Dev 1.13
0
2 (6.5%)
1
9 (29.0%)
2
8 (25.8%)
3
10 (32.3%)
4
1 (3.2%)
5
1 (3.2%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Does food at lunchtimes and in the evening, but not in between:

View Answers
Mean: 2.87 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.75
0
0 (0.0%)
1
2 (6.5%)
2
4 (12.9%)
3
22 (71.0%)
4
2 (6.5%)
5
1 (3.2%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Does food all day:

View Answers
Mean: 3.19 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.64
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
2 (6.5%)
3
23 (74.2%)
4
4 (12.9%)
5
2 (6.5%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Does breakfast:

View Answers
Mean: 2.97 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.75
0
0 (0.0%)
1
2 (6.7%)
2
3 (10.0%)
3
19 (63.3%)
4
6 (20.0%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Does afternoon tea and/or cream tea:

View Answers
Mean: 3.58 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.98
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
1 (3.2%)
3
14 (45.2%)
4
10 (32.3%)
5
4 (12.9%)
6
1 (3.2%)

Table service for food if you want it:

View Answers
Mean: 3.74 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.80
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
1 (3.2%)
3
11 (35.5%)
4
15 (48.4%)
5
3 (9.7%)
6
1 (3.2%)

Table service for drinks if you want it:

View Answers
Mean: 4.10 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.78
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
6 (19.4%)
4
18 (58.1%)
5
5 (16.1%)
6
2 (6.5%)

Mandatory table service for food:

View Answers
Mean: 4.47 Median: 5 Std. Dev 0.85
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
5 (16.7%)
4
8 (26.7%)
5
15 (50.0%)
6
2 (6.7%)

Mandatory table service for drinks:

View Answers
Mean: 4.58 Median: 5 Std. Dev 1.45
0
2 (6.5%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
2 (6.5%)
4
6 (19.4%)
5
14 (45.2%)
6
7 (22.6%)

Bread and/or olives and/or crudites etc brought when you sit down:

View Answers
Mean: 4.81 Median: 5 Std. Dev 1.16
0
1 (3.1%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
1 (3.1%)
4
7 (21.9%)
5
15 (46.9%)
6
8 (25.0%)

Pay for your meal before you eat it:

View Answers
Mean: 2.39 Median: 2 Std. Dev 0.66
0
0 (0.0%)
1
3 (9.7%)
2
13 (41.9%)
3
15 (48.4%)
4
0 (0.0%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Pay for your meal after you eat it:

View Answers
Mean: 3.90 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.78
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
10 (32.3%)
4
15 (48.4%)
5
5 (16.1%)
6
1 (3.2%)

Menu changes every week:

View Answers
Mean: 4.35 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.90
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
1 (3.2%)
3
4 (12.9%)
4
11 (35.5%)
5
13 (41.9%)
6
2 (6.5%)

Menu changes around once a month:

View Answers
Mean: 3.65 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.74
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
2 (6.5%)
3
10 (32.3%)
4
16 (51.6%)
5
3 (9.7%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Menu changes around once every 2-3 months:

View Answers
Mean: 2.94 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.84
0
0 (0.0%)
1
2 (6.5%)
2
5 (16.1%)
3
18 (58.1%)
4
5 (16.1%)
5
1 (3.2%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Menu changes less often:

View Answers
Mean: 2.19 Median: 2 Std. Dev 0.74
0
0 (0.0%)
1
5 (16.1%)
2
16 (51.6%)
3
9 (29.0%)
4
1 (3.2%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Menu never changes:

View Answers
Mean: 1.33 Median: 1 Std. Dev 0.75
0
3 (10.0%)
1
16 (53.3%)
2
9 (30.0%)
3
2 (6.7%)
4
0 (0.0%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Menu is printed on a single sheet of paper:

View Answers
Mean: 2.97 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.78
0
1 (3.2%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
4 (12.9%)
3
20 (64.5%)
4
6 (19.4%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Menu is printed on several sheets of paper on a clipboard:

View Answers
Mean: 3.68 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.89
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
2 (6.5%)
3
12 (38.7%)
4
12 (38.7%)
5
4 (12.9%)
6
1 (3.2%)

Menu is bound:

View Answers
Mean: 3.43 Median: 3 Std. Dev 1.05
0
1 (3.3%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
2 (6.7%)
3
13 (43.3%)
4
11 (36.7%)
5
2 (6.7%)
6
1 (3.3%)

Menu is laminated:

View Answers
Mean: 2.48 Median: 2 Std. Dev 0.62
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
15 (48.4%)
3
14 (45.2%)
4
1 (3.2%)
5
0 (0.0%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Menu is only available on a chalkboard:

View Answers
Mean: 3.52 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.88
0
0 (0.0%)
1
1 (3.2%)
2
1 (3.2%)
3
14 (45.2%)
4
11 (35.5%)
5
4 (12.9%)
6
0 (0.0%)

Menu blurb includes the name of the chef:

View Answers
Mean: 4.50 Median: 5 Std. Dev 1.15
0
1 (3.1%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
3 (9.4%)
4
9 (28.1%)
5
15 (46.9%)
6
4 (12.5%)

Has a separate "bar menu" and "main menu":

View Answers
Mean: 4.34 Median: 4 Std. Dev 0.99
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
6 (18.8%)
4
15 (46.9%)
5
5 (15.6%)
6
6 (18.8%)

Menus are set out on tables:

View Answers
Mean: 3.45 Median: 3 Std. Dev 0.76
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
21 (67.7%)
4
7 (22.6%)
5
2 (6.5%)
6
1 (3.2%)

Menus are brought when you sit down:

View Answers
Mean: 4.34 Median: 4.5 Std. Dev 1.13
0
1 (3.1%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
0 (0.0%)
3
4 (12.5%)
4
11 (34.4%)
5
13 (40.6%)
6
3 (9.4%)

Bowl of chips costs more than a pint of ale:

View Answers
Mean: 4.27 Median: 4 Std. Dev 1.02
0
0 (0.0%)
1
0 (0.0%)
2
1 (3.0%)
3
6 (18.2%)
4
14 (42.4%)
5
7 (21.2%)
6
5 (15.2%)

And also...

Poll #1418093
Open to: All, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 26

Dere Kake, I like you and all...

View Answers
but that poll is way too long for me to answer
4 (16.7%)
but I also like tickyboxes!
14 (58.3%)

You should also have included questions about:

Please feel free to link to this. The more responses the better.

LinkReply

Comments:
[User Picture]From: elvum
2009-06-19 02:02 pm (UTC)

(Link)

Yay! SCIENCE!
[User Picture]From: atommickbrane
2009-06-19 02:29 pm (UTC)

(Link)

God where to start. Mandatory table service = yr at a restaurant, no arguments.
[User Picture]From: damerell
2009-06-19 02:37 pm (UTC)

(Link)

But restaurant/pub isn't quite the same question as pub/gastropub. I think the former's simpler; if you could sensibly go there for a pint and no food, it's a pub.
[User Picture]From: atommickbrane
2009-06-19 02:42 pm (UTC)

(Link)

If you have mandatory table service it shouldn't be classed as a pub = my point. Bastards. I hate mandatory table service.
[User Picture]From: hoshuteki
2009-06-19 02:45 pm (UTC)

(Link)

It's strange because I've been in pubs I wouldn't even call gastropubs (for example, the Walpole in New Cross) which have mandatory table service, but it's usually because the people doing the food are a separate operation from the bar.
[User Picture]From: nou
2009-06-19 02:47 pm (UTC)

(Link)

These are almost always pubs that do Thai food, aren't they?

Actually, that might have been another useful question — whether they have a Thai food menu.
[User Picture]From: hoshuteki
2009-06-19 02:49 pm (UTC)

(Link)

Yes, Thai food = probably not a gastropub. I'd say almost certainly not, but I don't think of it as a dealbreaker. It all comes down to class distinctions. Gastropub = aspirational, poncy, upper-middle/middle/upper-lower-middle class. Pub = just get yr round in.
[User Picture]From: atommickbrane
2009-06-19 02:48 pm (UTC)

(Link)

Oh when the food is a separate business operating out of the pub premises I don't really see that so much as table service? Perhaps because it's always so fucking grim and horrible :) mandatory DRINK table service as well as food tho - deadly sin! The Riser attempts table service for food and drink but I think it's due to input of yankee tourists (I initially thought this was a lazy assumption but having carried out a few table analyses it does look likely. Also - they booked out a huge table the other day, with jugs of water and little pats of butter next to each plate! It's a PUB ffs!!)
[User Picture]From: hoshuteki
2009-06-19 02:52 pm (UTC)

(Link)

Heh, yes, when they shoo you away from the bar, it's a bit disconcerting, eh? Where is this Riser? The Rising Sun on TCR?
[User Picture]From: hoshuteki
2009-06-19 02:35 pm (UTC)

(Link)

Some of them I've answered 'not a gastropub' because it's more likely to be a restaurant (for example, wait to be seated = more likely not to be a gastropub because it's probably a restaurant), and some of them I would have answered differently if I thought I was assessing whether it was a gastropub vs a pub or vs being a bar or vs being a restaurant (some of the latter ones, like prints name of chef, I might have answered 1 or 2 for the same reason, but then I went the other way instead because at that moment I was thinking about it more likely being a gastropub than a regular pub).
[User Picture]From: nou
2009-06-19 02:39 pm (UTC)

(Link)

The intention is gastropub vs. pub.
[User Picture]From: hoshuteki
2009-06-19 02:42 pm (UTC)

(Link)

It'll be interesting to see how the responses break down in the end. Some things like low light (it's always been regular pubs which I've had more trouble reading in) or doesn't have handpulls (again far more pubs which don't serve any food of any description haven't had handpulls because ale drinkers tend to be more middle-class, therefore more likely to be in gastropubs) are already skewing both directions...
[User Picture]From: atommickbrane
2009-06-19 02:49 pm (UTC)

(Link)

Ale drinker = more likely to be middle class? I'm not sure how that one holds up!
[User Picture]From: hoshuteki
2009-06-19 02:50 pm (UTC)

(Link)

Either that or someone who's been drinking it since before the 1960s, when lager gained dominance over the youth drinking demographic (it currently still takes about 90% of all pub drinks sales, I think).

Which is to say that I think it comes down to demographics reflecting the changes in drinking patterns over the last 50 years; a lot of local pubs lost their handpulls over the years. Thinking about where I live, I know most of mine don't have any ale except for one (which happens to be a recently renovated one firmly pitched at people like me *shudder*).

Then again, I hate to start talking about some semi-mythical 'working class' person, because then it starts to become nasty and everyone starts going on about chavs and the like, and then you find yourself linking lager-drinking with all the lowest common denominator of society (like, regrettably, I've seen implied in certain CAMRA-type literature), and so I might as well be the Daily Mail right? So yeah, but yeah, take what I say with a pinch of salt.

Because, and I'm still trying to refine this very vague statement of belief, CAMRA have done a pretty great job over the past few decades at getting ale back into the national consciousness again. I think it's getting to a tipping point, or okay maybe not, but it's there and it doesn't look like it's going to die out any time. Gosh, I really need a pint.

Edited at 2009-06-19 03:33 pm (UTC)
[User Picture]From: nou
2009-06-19 02:50 pm (UTC)

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Possibly more likely to seek it out if you don't live near a pub that does it? Due to higher income and more leisure time?
[User Picture]From: shermarama
2009-06-22 09:11 pm (UTC)

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Come on, name me a real ale that sponsors a football team.
[User Picture]From: alan1957
2009-06-19 02:36 pm (UTC)

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Not answering cos I don't really do pubs anymore (since the ban - and a year or so before to break myself of the habit) and I don't actually know!
[User Picture]From: gaspodog
2009-06-19 02:53 pm (UTC)

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One thing I noticed going through is that the options I was inclined to tick could apply to Wetherspoon's establishements in many cases :) I don't class them as gastropubs though, so that did influence my responses...
[User Picture]From: nou
2009-06-19 04:22 pm (UTC)

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Interesting... which ones?
[User Picture]From: tomfinnie
2009-06-19 04:32 pm (UTC)

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"Has a seperate area for food only" for instance
[User Picture]From: nou
2009-06-19 04:34 pm (UTC)

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Oh, I've seen plenty of Wetherspoons with "dining areas", but in the context of "children may only sit in this area and no others", rather than "you must order food to sit here". I'll keep an eye out for the latter!
[User Picture]From: gaspodog
2009-06-19 05:19 pm (UTC)

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Wetherspoons always have menus on the tables, and some write things on chalkboards (even if they aren't actually specials of the day). I have been in one which had a 'wait to be seated' sign, but acknowledge that this is not normal :)

The separate dining areas mentioned below also, though generally they don't actually enforce any separation.

It's probably cheating to suggest you pay more for chips than a pint of ale in Wetherspoon's, as they've been doing some aggressive beer offers these days ;)
[User Picture]From: lnr
2009-06-19 03:11 pm (UTC)

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I think some of the features that people associate with gastropubs are also features I've encountered in serious real ale pubs. Pubs which are not gastropubs come in such a wide variety that for all but the most obviously restaurant-like features can be found in non-gastropubs, so would not on their own make it even *probably* a gastropub. And on the converse some gastropubs are really quite, well, pub-like too.

I tend to think vaguely "pub for drinking" "pub I'd happily eat at" "pub I'd go to specifically for the food" "pub I wouldn't try just have a drink in", and "real ale pub" and "real cider pub" I find completely orthogonal to that. And of course bars which aren't really pubs but sort of confuse the matter even further.
[User Picture]From: jvvw
2009-06-19 04:06 pm (UTC)

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This got me fascinated, and then I got phased because some pubs have two sections one for food and one for drinking and I'm not quite sure what that says about the pub or whether it's just the restaurant section that matters.
[User Picture]From: nou
2009-06-19 04:23 pm (UTC)

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Some pubs have separate restaurants, usually upstairs or something like that... I think that counts as a separate establishment really.
[User Picture]From: jvvw
2009-06-20 12:12 pm (UTC)

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I can think of examples too where it doesn't feel like a separate establishment - at one end of the scale, heston blumenthal's hinds head has a drinking area and eating area, at the other end a pub that I go to regular has drinking and eating areas that are slightly different in feel but without a wall between the two.
[User Picture]From: shermarama
2009-06-22 09:39 pm (UTC)

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I had to answer 3 to almost everything because in every case I could think of pubs which were plainly not gastropubs which did that, and yet also gastropubs that do. I don't think of the Pembury as a gastropub but it changes its menu every day. So does the Borringdon Arms in Turnchapel, and it's only available on a chalkboard, but it still features fish and chips and mushy peas for about seven quid, with no mention of multiple frying or hand-cutting. The World's End,, somewhere in the middle of nowhere in Dorset, is a pub you could go and drink in with stools at the bar and some non-eating tables, but also you have to wait to be seated and there's table service if you want food, and it's definitely not a gastropub. Also meanwhile, the Admiral Benbow that I was in at the weekend definitely counts as a gastropub in that you'd go there for the excellent and distinctive food at about 12-15 quid for a main course, but you'd also go there to get drunk (we had a lock-in, in a charmingly old-fashioned way) and there were drunk people dancing to the spectacularly tacky jukebox.

I dunno, I think it's hard to point to concrete things apart from the menu itself. My own definition, being applied when hungry in Penzance on Saturday evening and looking for a place to eat with reasonable speed, hinged on the style of the food, the fanciness of its description, and the price.